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[walt.l-@gmail.com] Who abandoned the discussion, Walt or Jason?  Errancy Archive
 Jul 22, 2007 20:27 PDT 

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: [errancy] Who abandoned the discussion, Walt or Jason?
Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 13:58:28 -0500
From: "Walt Lechman" <walt.l-@gmail.com>
Reply-To: erra-@iierrancy.com

Jason,

Here is the response I sent yesterday. Did you ever respond to it? If not,
then why are you claiming I'm the one who abandoned the conversation? If
so, I must have missed it. Please resend it and I will reply.


 Walt:
Jason, we don't need to borrow from the Bible in order to call evil what
it is. If we borrowed from the Bible, then our standards would align with
those of the Bible. The part of my response you cut out reveals this
obvious truth. You may keep waddling in your delusion if you wish,
however.

 
JASON
All you're doing is asserting, Walt. If you are correct in your
assertion, then answer a couple of questions and prove it.

1. What is evil?

Walt:
Evil is a subjective term used by individuals to distinguish those things
they define as good from those things they find to be appalling, wicked,
unjust, and morally reprehensible.

JASON
Then you just justified the Holocaust, rape, and murder. If truth is
subjective, then you cannot make a moral judgment against those things. For
instance, if murder is only wrong because one person says it's wrong, when
another person says it's right, it is right for them. This is how your
worldview falls apart and is inconsistent.

Walt:
Jason, I did not justify the Holocaust. I believe the Holocaust was unjust,
so it is impossible for me to justify the Holocaust. The fact that the
Nazis and others believe the Holocaust was justifiable proves my
point---that evil is a subjective term. If evil were not subjective, Jason,
then the Nazis would not have been able to justify the Holocaust.

I, however, believe the Holocaust was unjust. That's my belief. I can't
control what other people believe about the holocaust, but the fact that
some can view it as not evil, is why I say the term evil is subjective.

The fact that evil is subjective, however, that some view it as good and
some view it as evil, is not to say that those who view it as evil, yet
recognize that evil is subjective, believe the holocaust was justifiable.

Me saying that evil is subjective is simply an acknowledgment that there is
no measuring stick outside of individual perception by which we can gain the
absolute truth of whether or not an action is right or wrong, good or evil.
That is something we must decide for ourselves.

Now, if you would like to claim that there is a measuring stick, then by all
means, present your evidence for it.




    Jason: 2. How can you make a judgment about what is evil and what is not
 
 evil? What standard do you use to judge?

Walt:
I use my personal standard of right and wrong, good and evil to judge.

JASON
I already showed you above how personal standards of right and wrong are
inconsistent and justify atrocities.

By the way, I'll be happy to answer your questions after our
current discussion is complete.

Walt:
And I just showed you how your objections are fallacious. Equating that
because I recognize evil to be a subjective term with me justifying the
holocaust, Jason, is fallacious and ridiculous.

It's like me saying that vanilla ice cream is the best ice cream in the
world, and you asking how I know it is the best ice cream in the world, and
me replying that it is subjective. Then you saying, well, you just admitted
that chocolate ice cream is the best ice cream in the world.

No, I said vanilla ice cream is the best ice cream in the world. Just
because Joe Blow thinks chocolate ice cream is the best ice cream in the
world, that doesn't mean I believe it is. I just recognize that their
perception of what is the "best" ice cream in the world is different than
mine, and that there is no standard outside of myself and Joe Blow to tell
us (and by which we can know) what the best ice cream in the world is.


---

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